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Did Hideyoshi have a fake mustache?

 
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JLBadgley
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 15, 2014 11:02 am    Post subject: Did Hideyoshi have a fake mustache? Reply with quote
So, I saw this on a pop-culture site, and did a search and have since seen it elsewhere, but does anyone know if it is confirmed that Hideyoshi had fake facial hair so that he could be seen as "manly" enough as a warrior? Or is this something later (possibly anti-Toyotomi propoganda)? I don't recall this from any of the history I've read about him.

-Josh
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shikisoku
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 15, 2014 9:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
It seems 当代記 Todaiki describes about his fake mustache.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 15, 2014 9:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Found it.

Todaiki
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5th line from right”此時つくり髭をし"
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shikisoku
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 15, 2014 9:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Todaiki in Google book
http://books.google.co.jp/books?id=GMASmTnd5RIC
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 15, 2014 10:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
According to the ja wikipedia, tht book is an early Edo peiod book Influenced greatly by Nobunaga-ki (Shincho-ki). Since the comment is presented as an added note in the middle of ordering attacks inthe Odawara campain, it does not seem very impressive. And by 1590, wouldn't, his qualifications as a warrior be settled?
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 16, 2014 6:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
I don't think it's anything about "qualifications as a warrior". I also don't think it's after-the-fact fun poking at him. People in positions of power were supposed to look a certain way. If having facial hair was one of those things, then it's certainly reasonable (given the time and context) that he'd fake it if he couldn't make it. I kind of think this is something that we today look at as "WHOA, he wore a fake mustache? LOSER!" but in the time, wouldn't have raised a plucked and re-brushed in eyebrow.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 16, 2014 7:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
It would not surprise me at all. Imagawa Yoshimoto had his eyebrows painted to look like a Kyoto aristocrat. Nobunaga had his eyebrows painted for the 1581 Kyoto parade. It would have been probably the norm if Hideyoshi did paint his moustache.
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JLBadgley
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 19, 2014 1:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
The kuge fashion of painted eyebrows were always painted; I know of no human who could naturally grow that look of perpetual surprise.

If it was expected of warriors to grow a mustache or beard, I could understand him using a false one to make sure he looked the part, but I want aware that the hige was such an important feature of what made a warrior; though of course they make sure to add one to all of the mempo.

Do we know what false hige looked like at the time? Painted, or attached with glue or string? Any ideas?


Josh
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ltdomer98
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 19, 2014 2:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
JLBadgley wrote:

Do we know what false hige looked like at the time? Painted, or attached with glue or string? Any ideas?


Everything I've seen in period dramas shows a hair mustache attached with some sort of glue, but that's hardly a source I'd cite. Seems reasonable enough, though. 1996's "Hideyoshi" shows him having a paste-on mustache in his later years.

I don't think painted on makes sense. Again, no real source for this, other than if you wanted it to look real, paint would just look silly. The eyebrows aren't meant to look real, as you point out. My point in bringing that up was that modification of physical appearance to "fit" a certain class ideal was nothing new.

I wouldn't dwell too much on it being "expected" that a warrior have a beard. My point is that it is "A" marker of virility/manliness, not "THE" or an absolutely necessary one. Much like today, if the scrawny hipster can't bulk up to look manly, he grows a ridiculous beard because hey, he can do that.
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 3:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
owari no utsuke wrote:
It would not surprise me at all. Imagawa Yoshimoto had his eyebrows painted to look like a Kyoto aristocrat. Nobunaga had his eyebrows painted for the 1581 Kyoto parade. It would have been probably the norm if Hideyoshi did paint his moustache.


You know, this is rather off-topic, but I have been wondering what "painted eyebrows" meant in the Shinchou ko ki. Am I to understand that Nobunaga had that black dot eyebrow thing painted on?
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JLBadgley
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 11:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
ltdomer98 wrote:
Everything I've seen in period dramas shows a hair mustache attached with some sort of glue, but that's hardly a source I'd cite. Seems reasonable enough, though. 1996's "Hideyoshi" shows him having a paste-on mustache in his later years.


That fits what I was thinking.

Josh
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